›

"Going from A to B" vs "Understanding from A to B"

Roger Smith
in General
Hi Adam,
In some of your videos you 'gently' admonish those imagers that don't care so much what they are doing between A (processing images) and B (posting on Facebook). They just want a step by step recipe to follow. IMO, these are just personality types, and I am not saying one is right, or one is wrong.

To me you are obviously an "Understanding from A to B" person. You have put great energy in your videos to explain as clearly and as simply as possible the "Understanding" of imaging processing. Thank you!   Your method allows those imagers (I mean us wanna be Understanding types) to actually get a feeling what Juan is doing on the mathematical (and other) sides, without having a college degree in mathematics. Now I am becoming brave enough to read the documentation and not run away when I see all those equations. 

So I was wondering if you were familiar with the book, "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance"? Wikipedia has a good summary, but basically it a long, philosophical story about a father and son on a multi-day motorcycle trip. One person is an A to B person, and the other the Understanding type. Their approach to life's little events are compared and contrasted. There seems to me to be a lot of parallels with asto-imaging, and I mean everything from: Imaging system setup, to actual imaging, and on to processing with PI.

Best regards,
   Roger

Comments

  • BlockHeadBlockHead
    Hi Roger,

    I have not read the book...but it interests me. Thank you for the suggestion.
    One of the reasons I highlight the deeper-processing line of reasoning is somewhat utilitarian in that I am certainly trying to set myself apart from other superficially similar offerings. The other thing is a bit of a tilting at windmills exercise- does it really matter if anyone understands what a bi-weighted k-sigma thing is?  Of course not- but I refuse to let parameters and concepts be "mysterious" and magical. Many aspects of image processing are generalized as short cuts- but without an understanding of why it is a shortcut, it is easy to fall prey to all of the times the generalization is not applicable. 

    As you know, more recently I have created a "Recipe" for which I had to make choices and decisions as to how to present the material (FastTrack Training). It was difficult to say stuff that only work in a narrow domain- but it was my hope that once people get in the door- some of the other information persuades them to continue to learn more.

    I don't have a degree in math and none of this information is taught at an undergraduate level. So... the information I am delivering is pretty much a product of my research or experience (experimentation). 

    You are probably right concerning the personality types. I have attempted to try to "convert" a few of the only-wanting-step-by-step..and failed. Just today there was a post on exactly this subject on the PI forum. There are many things contradictory in the "rant" of frustration. Why? he asks does he need a degree in math/physics to understand image processing. He says he presses a few buttons in other software..and they just "work"... BUT..he continues that this marvelous software does not give him color in his stars....  You see what happened right there? There is a misconception that just because you get a result, it is in someway optimal. He does not acknowledge the sub-optimal result or the fact that each time you do the same steps..the result will be the same...the parameter space is small...no room to adjust in this other software. PixInsight is at  the other end of the spectrum... giving all the Universe in terms of adjustment... but then he complains... why does that have to be hard.  This is likely not my customer...but I could be wrong.

    -the Blockhead


  • Roger Smith
    I am smiling from ear to ear!
    Well written response.
    Adam,
    Personally I think the PI team has been very accommodating to their customers by continuing to develop the original Batch Processing to WBPP, and now upgrading to WBPP2.0. WBPP is getting closer to that cookbook style preferred by some.

    Maybe the next successful imaging software will be called "Presto" (an Android/ IPhone App). It will wirelessly connect to the camera/mount, and to social media sites like FB. After 20 frames captured, and 10 minutes internal processing (you know, in the phone), the final image pops up on the user's FB home page, and 5 different forums he signed up for. Wow, such a dream (hehe). APOD here I come!
    Roger

  • BlockHeadBlockHead
    But... with regards to WBPP... I am making certain that it clearly communicates what is going on... effectively teaching image calibration. So I think there is a little educational content now... that is consistent and aligned with best practices. 

    -the Blockhead
  • Casey Schatz
    "Zen And The Art Of Motorcycle Maintenance" is possibly one of the greatest books ever written and has become a part of my daily existence...Adam does not want folks to be 'John' who  are on the 'romantic' side and do not wish to know the inner workings of things. The example of refusing to use the aluminum can as a shim is a perfect example. John and Silvia just  'want things to work' and refuse to get their hands dirty like the dripping faucet example. Pirsig makes it clear it's not a lack of intelligence, it's just a world view that's tough to change someone from. Maybe this is the case for that person on PI form who was upset.

    For me, I love that Adam get's deep into the theory and I truly want to know how and why every pixel gets there. That being said, about 15 minutes ago I replied to a post essentially saying "Hey it be great if there was a bit more of a roadmap!" just because between work and having a 5 year old I'm pulled between wanting to learn EVERYTHING but also having a nifty image to show for my efforts. So maybe the answer as always is somewhere in the middle: The 'Presto' crowd of instant gratification likely are not going to be AB's customers and the images will likely not be realized to their full potential. On the other extreme, I feel like the girl with thick glasses struggling with the book report because there were so many ideas swirling she had to be told to look progressively closer at the building across the street. Eventually focusing on one brick let the floodgate of thought go. 

    So glad that someone else has made a parallel with this book and imaging !!
    Casey


  • Roger Smith
    I fully agree with you Casey, except (luckily) I don't feel like the girl with the thick glasses! 
    Well written. The "Presto" crowd was the best!
    Our journey continues with Adam, the universe, and our individual intellects.
    Roger
Sign In or Register to comment.